Public Beta Test Of Pianoscope v4

Patrick

Frank Illenberger Great news - thanks Frank! Question. Has the online User Manual been updated to reflect the v4 changes?

Frank Illenberger

Patrick Yes: New User Manual

Patrick

Frank Illenberger Excellent - thank you!

MilanDka

Hi Frank, I still can't justify using this new feature.
I understand that users want it—even demand it. However, during a rough pitch raise, I measure how flat the piano is using a-moll, mute the strings with felt (always the left and right in the unison), tune the center strings, and then tune the left and right strings of the unison by ear—always within the entire section. This way, I have the piano pre-tuned to a playable quality in 30 minutes. Even with preparation (placing the felt between strings and measuring the overpull mode), it takes 35 minutes max. I’ve tried the new spectrum tuning feature twice now—not only does it take at least an hour, but the result is unlistenable.

Frank Illenberger

MilanDka thanks for the detailed feedback. I understand your workflow, and this feature isn’t meant to replace that. For experienced techs using mutes efficiently, your approach will likely remain faster and better. The mute-less pitch raise is mainly an option for situations where someone wants a quick, no-setup first pass without inserting mutes, followed by a normal fine tuning afterwards. It’s not intended to produce a fully playable result on its own.

MilanDka

Frank Illenberger If, however, the piano remains significantly out of tune in the rough tuning mode without damping, a single fine tuning will not be sufficient. I only see the logic in this function when new strings are installed and you pitch them by simple plucking (pizzicato tuning without the action or dampers). Even then, there is a question of how functional this solution will be, as the differences between strings within a single trichord can be as much as a sixth.

Frank Illenberger

MilanDka Why should it remain significantly out of tune after the rough tuning? It should not be a problem to get closer than 1 Cent with the spectrum view.

MilanDka

Frank Illenberger The issue will be in the definition of "significantly out of tune" 😂 Maybe the mistake is on my part, but even 15 years ago, when I tried this function on TuneLab, I found it slow, inefficient, and inaccurate. If you have a variance of, say, 5\text{ Hz} even in the rough tuning, it will affect the fine tuning—the tones will start to "beat" or wobble. Not to mention that you are listening to a very out-of-tune piano the whole time, which actually slightly ruins your perception of pure tones.
Please take all of this purely as a discussion. For me as a technician, the tuning curves, overall user-friendliness, and UI usability are significantly more important than a function that I can replace more effectively by ear.

Frank Illenberger

MilanDka I agree that an accuracy of around 1 cent is not a good sounding tuning but it should be close enough so that a following fine pass will succeed in a nice tuning. I also agree that listening to undamped unisons during a pitch-raise is not for everybody 😃 . Nobody is forcing you to use the spectrum view and I also don't tell everbody to use it. It is a tool that's available to be used if you need it.

MilanDka

Dear Frank,
I get it. I understand everything you’re writing. I just don’t quite grasp why someone would require such a function. However, within the context of the complexity of your software, I understand and it actually makes sense.
When someone is learning to tune, their first step shouldn't even be focusing on a curve, temperament, the pitch of concert A, etc. For maybe two months, they should just tune unisons. Then, add pure intervals without temperament. Only once they have mastered this—absolutely securely—can they move forward. Start tempering and discovering the relationship to M3s and M6s, or M10s. Anything you skip has an impact on the quality of the tuning.
On top of that, you build experience with pitch raising. And once you’ve gone through all of this, you actually don’t need many of the features, not just from your software. What I truly love about Pianoscope is the overpull mode. It is the best out of all the software I’ve ever tried. And the freeze function—also very useful.
Have a nice day in Germany.
Milan

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